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Messages - link1313

Pages: [1] 2
Blue bell is a ranged attack is it not? Why do you say melee.

I don't think the 17% melee reduction counts to your ehp.

Crit is not as good because monks can serenity (or mantra?) the damage away. Also I am using bash to catch monks so you should be measuring dps with aps included.

Please post your dprogress vs monk items so I can do the math.

Where do I seem offended to you? I said I believe your math is wrong, that's not me taking offense I stand by statistics. Let me know if you find out if blue bell is melee

Hey raven were you looking at my base all resists or did you miss the extra 370 base holy resist I am stacking vs mie for his blue bell build? (diabloprogress does not show this.)

I am 99% sure your math is wrong. Can you take a snapshot of diabloprogress with your gear and post the url here? I will do the math when I get home.

I have 34% reduce elites gear in the stash top bt belt/boots/storm etc. It can't compare to the ehp I currently have.

I do agree top us monks >>> eu monks though..

what was your setup when u tested link?

I agree I do have some problems vs monk, but not because of their dps but because of their stalemate ability with tempest rush, if they play safe I can never catch them and eventually I will do a mistake.

Vs non-tempest builds it is actually a lot more fun, balanced and fast. I tested vs Tomas a while ago, his build was normal bells and sss, no tr. In first games he got me more, last time it was 5-4 for me, after that he switched to palm to counter my dodge and got me more ( i didn't try to optimize my build vs palm but it can be done).

I also tested my setup vs his blue bells, standing still he got 2 crit blue bells in about 20 shots... because I have ~40% dodge vs monks and his cc was around 50 i think. Basically the chance to get 2 crit blue bells in a row is extremely small, but if they just run around the map for 1 hour they will eventually get it because it's very hard for barbs to catch them.

in my d3cl duel vs mnich, i started 3-0 but lost 3-5. Basically at first he played less safe while i played safe, after that he started running and waiting for cds, while i got bored of playing safe and made mistakes, the same happened vs psykes with his tankier stalemate build, the duel lasted for more than 1.5 hours... which was actually the reason why I left the league... I enjoyed much more getting 0-5 vs insane than chasing a tr monk for hours around the map.

My EHP with dodge (but without block) vs melee elites  (dunno if bells and/or sss are melee or ranged) with the skills used is around 14mil, slightly more with block but block doesn't do much vs monks; a lot more if I would have used superstition (~17mil) instead of unforgiving, and tried to stalemate. dps was 58k+6%, so around 61 let's say. (vs psykes with his stalemate-ish build i went to about 90k dps still tanking pretty well if I played safe but still almost impossible to kill him when he played safe)

156k life, 940ar, 11.3k armor, 39,6% dodge, -16,94 vs melee, -30% vs elites (I have 35% on gear but it's multiplicative not additive)

my personal approach is dodge because a crit blue bell does anyway a lot more than 50% damage. Ideally you would want to be able to tank 2 crit blue bells without IP but I dunno if it's possible, maybe vimer with his more "raw" ehp gear can do it.

The biggest problem is if they crit with first bell you have to IP to survive a second, not very likely, crit and after that you risk getting sss.

As I mentioned before, my personal problem with this match-up, is tempest rush, not their damage. I use unforgiving, warcry dodge and threatening shout for fury gain, with sprint and charge to catch them, but it doesn't seem enough, maybe other barbs can share what skills they use in this match-up.

and yeah, nerfing threatening vs tempest rush monks is a joke...

I agree DarkRaven the real issue may be tempest rush, but I don't want to jump to that conclusion yet.

Item wise i have a lot of build options vs monk. Currently i am testing setups to beat a pure tempest rush/stun/blue bell monk. I have other builds vs stun/sss/exploding palm/wave of light or dashing/stun/wave of light/sss or pure exploding palm only etc.


The only way I am able to catch a tempest rushing monk is with 24% movement, charge , threatening shout, sprint marathon, and bash stun. The real problem is having enough fury generation combined with survivability in order to catch them, if you try to use unforgiving EHP is much too low.

Active Skills
Bash - Clobber
Furious Charge - Stamina
Sprint - Marathon
Threatening Shout - Intimidate
Ignore Pain - Iron Hide
Rend - Ravage

Passive Skills
Inspiring Presence
Nerves Of Steel

This is the build I am having the most success with right now. Sometimes I will swap bash with war cry but vs monks like mafia with 65k health globes and 80k+ life its very hard to land enough rends in a row to kill them.

I have not asked for a nerf to monks I am just saying statistics say it is a difficult matchup for barbs and I will keep testing with mie later today, I will let you guys know.

I've been doing non stop testing vs monks the past couple days. (viri, miejueshitai, mafia, shisky, lazar, etc). This is a very tough matchup for barb.

I am still in the process of testing builds and I am getting closer to finding one that works. However it involves stacking single resists in order to be viable which may not work if monk switches from wave of light (arcane) to exploding palm (physical) for example.  I have reached 15 million+ ehp with 60k dps and still can get 2 shot by blue bell. Exploding palm / SS (physical) is much easier to deal with but it still is in monks favour if i drop single resists and switch to more elite % and more vitality (~13 million ehp) but at that point cant survive a stun/wave combo without popping ignore pain, then they come back at you with sss while ignore pain is down.

I am forced to use items like legacy mempo (80 all res, 50 arcane, 75 vitality, 11% life) and lucky craft rolls (i.e. shoulders 50+ arcane, 200+ vit, 12% life, 80 all res) in order to have a slight chance.

monk - barb ; America:
5;4 (sky is mie's friend irl , mie said he gave him 4 free wins)

16 wins monk
7 wins barb (5 were by me)

80 fight wins for monk
48 fight wins for barb

i'm an analyst irl i have put enough time into this to know, if a d3cl rule developer wants to talk more about the math on this matchup feel free to add me linkolas#1725.

i will let you guys know if i come up with a solution for monks with the current rules.

edit: just noticed threatening shout is now going to be banned too. Can't catch monks without threatening shout (intimidate)

Rules & development / Re: =HOT= NEW RULES =HOT=
« on: May 30, 2013, 01:19:27 am  »
i kinda lol'd at threatening shout being banned vs monks.

have you not been 1 shotted recently?

Community information and announcements / Re: US & EU D3CL Season #2
« on: May 17, 2013, 05:41:49 am  »
spirit walk/hex/fear/vessel force barbs to use wotb = no fun  >:(

how can you allow all 4.

Rules & development / Re: Ruleversion 1.2.6 [Open Discussion]
« on: May 14, 2013, 06:04:32 am  »
-   Duels are played with best of 9.
-   Maximum duel time is 45 minutes starting from the first ‘go’ from both sides.

does this mean maximum allowed MATCH time is 45 minutes or 6.75 hours?

Community information and announcements / Re: US & EU D3CL Season #2
« on: May 11, 2013, 01:56:32 am  »
Thanks for starting up the season. Some interesting rule choices. Should be fun for some matches.

Rules & development / Re: Ruleversion 1.2.6 [Open Discussion]
« on: May 10, 2013, 00:09:47 am  »
when is season 2 starting?

Rules & development / Re: Ruleversion 1.2.6 [Open Discussion]
« on: May 01, 2013, 03:59:16 am  »
From what I've seen a lot of barbs greatly undervalue dodge, like it's not "real" ehp.

The only matchup were is not yet needed is vs other barbs, where rend is only atk.

All barbs get 30-34 block shields whereas 2% more dodge does so much more than 2% more block.... and dex even up to 1000 is a very good way to tank up.

Dodge also can prevent stuns and prevent stuff triggered on crit, like CM, whereas block can't.

Warcry dodge is a very good rune, impunity only is better vs dot damage like rend or some skorn exploding palm or haunts but even vs those classes I prefer dodge.

Ofc u need to have high ar on gear to balance not using impunity.

yup dodge is very underrated. i don't undervalue it i even preferred it for some slots where it can roll really high like boots/gloves (100str/200dex/100vit blackthornes boots are possible , 200str/200dex/80 all res ik gloves are possible)

interesting idea with shield. although 200 str /150 dex / 150 vit stormshields are hard to find as there are always monks / dhs looking for those. i prefer the 350 str / 150 vit stormshield another underrated and better option than the 200 str / 200 vit or 200 str / 10 crit stormshield

Rules & development / Re: Inspiring presence for 1.08
« on: April 24, 2013, 21:26:56 pm  »
Wizards just need to wait for the itemization patch,

Buffed frostburns and buff ilvl 58 or whatever wand that adds 30% cold damage  8)

Rules & development / Re: Inspiring presence for 1.08
« on: April 24, 2013, 14:48:59 pm  »
Well technically the ip buff wasn't "for" anyone, just hardcore pve barbs and pvp use regen

I think blizzard just looked at the lack of players using life regen in softcore pve and said "this skill need buff" without thinking  ;D

Now hardcore barbs mad every class gets buff but them haha

Rules & development / Re: Inspiring presence for 1.08
« on: April 24, 2013, 06:08:49 am  »
Blue post TL;DR:

Inspiring Presence is going back to 2% but with AoE effect (no effect in PVP).

However, I think the Brooding and Blood Ritual bonuses are going to be 2% still. You guys think that is ok? Or do we need to ban those skills? (I don't use brooding anyways with my playstyle.)
good news. i think it should have been 3% due to the other life regen buffs but i guess ill take the invigorate buff  ;)

Rules & development / Re: Ruleversion 1.2.6 [Open Discussion]
« on: April 19, 2013, 19:43:08 pm  »
Exactly ^^

Starting to limit gear choices is a dangerous path to go down but it would need to be done if it really is 4%.

Rules & development / Re: Ruleversion 1.2.6 [Open Discussion]
« on: April 19, 2013, 18:53:15 pm  »
4% is blizzard serious?

Is there a barbs against this change thread yet?

D3cl admins you can't ban this skill either, its pretty much a must have for pvp.

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BlackRain , 2006 by Crip
Diablo 3 PvP, Diablo 3 PvP

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