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31

Rules & development / Re: Ruleversion 1.2.5

« on: March 19, 2013, 14:32:33 pm  »

As some DH´s mentioned before, the matchup vs Monk(good Monks) is very hard without Chemical burn.
I played vs Tobi, he goes into defensive mode with shield and runs very clever around walls..1 mistake by the DH and he is 1 shoted, no matter how much hp he got, the dmg that monks do, is sick. I think the most monks just play to aggressive, try to force a kill no matter what.
The question here is, why should i need 4,5 direct hits without Chemical Burn to kill a Monk, and he still kills me by landing 1? So i take a quote from the DH vs Barb discussion "But its not our fault that they lack on dps - i told 2 weeks ago that they have to use both setups legacy and new natalia to be as flexible as they need to be to win".
I change it to "It´s not our fault, that they lack defense to take some hits by us". Try to go more defensive vs Dh´s dear Monks, and after this period...we can still talk about baning "CB".

If you get 1-shotted by a shield monk, you're both undergeared defensively and very unlucky. Also even with a shield and full elite reduction gear, monks get 2/3-shot by dh's. On top of that, DH's have much better healing capabilities than Monk has, lower cooldowns, superior movement etc etc....Anyway, no point in theorycrafting this rule more as both monks and dh's somehow feel like they're the underdog in the matchup...let the test league decide

32

Rules & development / Re: Ruleversion 1.2.5

« on: March 18, 2013, 19:24:30 pm  »

Against Monks, I feel the Chemical Burn disables the DH offensive power by too much. My experience against good Monks is with Chemical Burn I win 80% of the time, without Chemical Burn I win 30% of the time; which is a huge difference. The reason is that the duels last considerably longer and I must not get hit for a longer period of time. Monks do such incredible damage with their Spirit spending skills now that, on critical hits, they can 1-shot almost any DH. DH also have no second chance ability, so 1-shot and it's over. Whereas Monks take 3-4 high powered critical hits to take down if they have the EHP (due to Serenity, Near Death Experience, and possibly potions if they stack bonus to heath globes and potions). Also, in general, Monks have higher dodge chance than DH and with our discipline limitations (non-legacy), we cannot win that war of attrition (especially if most hits are simply missing the Monk). I propose either a different change to DH such as Sharpshooter ban, or an additional restriction of Near Death Experience banned with Chemical Burn banned.

I think you're being very loose with using those percentages there. My impression is that after the chemical burn u will still beat all non_rice monks 80% of the time, while maybe losing to him specifically 30-70 because he might have simply outplayed you. You beat me around 30-1 even without chemical burn and I fail to see that my gear and playskill are so much worse that a 70% advantage for me turned into a 95% disadvantage. Even though you destroyed me, the duels atleast felt very fair and fun to me and the DH actually needs some skill to get a kill instead of just sniping and always staying out of range.

33

The Monk / Re: Skill setups against the different classes

« on: March 17, 2013, 21:21:45 pm  »

I found both the heal and the dmg boost quite significant and I often struggle finding the spirit to cast all of bells, ds and sss. It's very rare in my experience that sss does something that bells don't do in most matchups. The option to have sss is nice ofcourse so I understand your point, but I'd just rather have the 'passive' bonuses of boh-blazing wrath.

34

The Monk / Skill setups against the different classes

« on: March 16, 2013, 23:05:38 pm  »

Hello fellow monks!

Monks aren't currently doing too well in the league so I'd like to start a discussion for us to share winning strategies with one another. I'll share my current skill setups to start things of. I think they speak for themselves so I won't bore you with the actual combat tactics. One thing to keep in mind is to have atleast 3 spirit regen. Ideally you get this from gear (Inna's helm + soj) but if you can't, then use Mantra of Healing - Circular breathing.

Enjoy

vs Barbarian

This is a very interesting and balanced matchup and the optimal skill set heavily depends on the opponent. I usually start out with the following setup. Other spells that I really like against barbs are Blinding Flash - Faith in the Light + SSS for nice burst when all they do is rend and run and if they don't run at all then SW-Cyclone is very strong. The setup below is very balanced to work decent against both types of barbs.

FoT - Thunderclap
WoL - Empowered Wave
Serenity - Ascension
BoH - Blazing Wrath
Exploding Palm - Flesh of the Weak
Mantra of Conviction - Submission

Seize the Initiative
Near Death Experience
Beacon of Ytar

vs Witchdoctor

Very tough fight. A good WD will keep constant pressure on you so you have no choice but to go all out offensive. I've had best success with the following skill set:

FoT - Thunderclap
WoL - Empowered Wave
Serenity - Ascension
BoH - Blazing Wrath
Dashing Strike - Flying Side Kick
Mantra of Evasion - Divine Protection

Seize the Initiative
Near Death Experience
Beacon of Ytar

vs DH

I'm at a complete loss against a top DH, but this is what works fairly well for me against average ones:

FoT - Thunderclap
Exploding Palm - Flesh of the Weak
Serenity - Instant Karma
BoH - Blazing Wrath
Dashing Strike - Flying Side Kick
Mantra of Evasion - Hard Target

STI
NDE
BoY

vs Wizard

Anything works here, poor wizards.

vs Monk

Same setup as versus Barbs.

35

Rules & development / Re: Monk vs DH balance

« on: March 15, 2013, 22:05:13 pm  »

Cap dodge at 70% for monk and take away chemical burn. I'm cool with that.

the monk in question stacked all kinds of buffs that only last a few seconds when they proc. There's no way this build is viable in pvp and even if someone does use it, the 100% bock only lasts like a second. He'll have at best around 70% base dodge and sacrifices a ton of much better spells to get there.

I saw some objections to banning Chemical Burn in other threads but haven't seen any proper argumentation or other ways to balance this matchup which at the moment is almost an auto-loss for monks.

Any more ideas?

36

Rules & development / Re: Ruleversion 1.2.5

« on: March 15, 2013, 21:52:26 pm  »

I played against Kimsulki84, a decent monk with good experience yesterday and I was determined to win without Chemical Burn. The duels lasted a LOT longer and it played out almost like a DH vs Barb match. The monk retreats when his Serenity is down and I fire some Impale - Overpenetration at him but they wiff 70% of the time lol. Then the match resets and we try again, and again, and again until either A) I get lucky and hit him a couple times in a row or B) he gets lucky and catches me with his Wave of Light - Explosive Wave at an odd angle. I had the upper-hand but the monk got impatient and complained about long duels lol (I wonder what he would say if he saw DH vs Barb duels).

Good post Iria. Sounds like the matchup got more balanced atleast. Explosive wave is absolutely horrible to use. It costs 30seconds worth of regenerating spirit with a balanced setup, is insanely hard to aim and if it gets dodged, it's all for nothing. I really wish Monks had other ways to kill a top dh.

37

The Demon Hunter / Re: DH vs Rest (TacticZ+Little guide)

« on: March 14, 2013, 17:21:36 pm  »

How About DH vs Full tank monk?

"Full Tank Monk" is:
1h + shield
full blackthorn's set
litany
+ 50k bonus on potions from items
ecc...

just keep distance and you can never lose, even full defensive monks die to 1-2 chemical burns

38

General discussion / Re: Letting BLUE posts on Bnet know what we feel - Got Vaneras attention

« on: March 13, 2013, 21:23:24 pm  »

lol that BoneEater post is totally undercover PR.

Lol indeed, I wonder if it's Vaneras' 2nd account that he uses to speak in non-official mode

39

General discussion / Re: Letting BLUE posts on Bnet know what we feel - Got Vaneras attention

« on: March 13, 2013, 17:05:26 pm  »

nice post Jointit, I agree wholeheartedly.
Unfortunately though, the tone of the blue's reply to you sounds like 'stfu' to me
Vaneras obviously has no clue what you're talking about and was probably hired for that reason..

40

Community information and announcements / Re: D3CL is looking for judges

« on: March 13, 2013, 15:13:13 pm  »

you can put me down for US judge

years of d2 judging experience (and lvl1 magic the gathering judge, lol)

41

Rules & development / Re: Monk vs DH balance

« on: March 10, 2013, 21:33:54 pm  »

Thanks a lot for the input guys! It seems everyone agrees that DH has too much of an edge here and it seems like banning Chemical Burn in this matchup will level the playing field quite a bit so I will propose this for the new rule set due tomorrow.

42

Rules & development / Re: Monk vs DH balance

« on: March 09, 2013, 01:58:48 am  »

You're right, Sharpshooter is insanely strong in pvp.
I've played against many Legacy DH's and haven't really had trouble with any of them. For me a DH with very high ehp is much much harder.

43

Rules & development / Re: Monk vs DH balance

« on: March 09, 2013, 01:38:31 am  »

Right, and that's ok I think. DH shouldn't get hit by melee unless he makes a mistake. The problem is that he can make mistakes and take hits but can still escape and regen afterwards.

Do you think banning Sharpshooter alone is enough to balance the matchup?

44

Rules & development / Re: Monk vs DH balance

« on: March 09, 2013, 00:36:10 am  »

i mean pillar hugging shouldn't have to be the answer. The rules shouldn't promote passive play as the only viable option to win a particular matchup.

Banning Sharpshooter is a nice start

45

Rules & development / Monk vs DH balance

« on: March 09, 2013, 00:24:05 am  »

Hello there,

I'd like to start a separate topic to discuss the balance of this particular matchup. As a Monk, I feel like I am at a serious disadvantage here, given equal gear, but it is completely possible that I'm just being outplayed or biased towards my own class so I'd like other opinions and ideas to balance this matchup even more.

Some of my observations:

- If I can't 1-shot the DH, I can't kill him at all since he heals too fast.
- If the DH plays carefully, I can never ever reach him

I think either of these points alone would be fine, but combined, it's just too much and I would propose either of points below as a solution:

- cap hp at lets say 60k for DH and WD, 100k for all others.
- ban Vault

Are these nerfs too much? Would any other changes be better?

Discuss