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[franq]

Your right i dont know the problems of your side, thats why im asking for suggestion on what you think would balance the matches out

We both know that we will die in face to face situation with good barb dont matter what set we have. The problem is you can hit&run all the time, we can hit&run maybe 30 seconds. With non-legacy DH barb should have banned big hp regeneration or sprint.

The same problem is with legacy DH vs non-legacy DH - we both can kill each other with 1-2 shoots, but non-legacy just dont have dyscypline after 10-15 seconds of fight and he die. The only way to face legacy dh without legacy set is to make full tank with 40k dps for gear worth 10b or more (like emmet). In this duel we should make something to balance dysc (banning preparation in legacy DH?) or banning speed passive in legacy DH (to forbid their hit&run tactics until enemy dont have dyscypline).

if you forbid hit and run tactics until enemy has reged up the disc its a big advantage for new nats users because they have more dmg and more ehp and still the same amount of disc comparing to legacy users... lol bad idea...
its as if u play oldnat without discregen vs newnat!

and for the example vs barb... its just ... ban inspiring presence for new nats users... EDIT: new nats users or even mempo users do average 90k more dmg UNBUFFED what also helps ALOT in killing high hp barbs comparing to oldnats users...

for old nats vs new nats... maybeeeee ban tactical advantage... but still if u have a decent disc pool with like 60-70 u wont run out of disc ... as many ppl wrote in rules topic that actually play new nats and dont want oldnats ban..

i use both sets old and new one(bad new one) and in some situations even new one is better... but MOST ppl cant afford both with good stats and the ones that use old one now cant just buy new ones if it gets banned...

the ones with new ones ofc can keep using it because it wont ever get banned... so simple: dont ban any of them because u cant force ppl to buy new items they farmed hundreds of hours for or spend real money!

[Crensh]

in my humble opinion all Legacy items should be banned from the league. it just seems common sense to me if an item was removed from the loot tables then it is no longer mean to be used.

[predsr]

It wasnt removed because it was too strong, it was removed because the item got upgraded ilvl's

[kriptony-TBA]

Just make 2 different ruling for DH and Legacy DH as if they were 2 different class.

[Iria]

I know this has been discussed but I would like to know the status of this topic. Currently, I don't think I can win (as a non-legacy DH) against a legacy DH with medium-high end gear (enough to not get 1shot) since they can just force me to burn discipline rapidly and kill me when I run out. Have any non-legacy DH been able to compete with legacy DH without a discipline problem? This is the one match up I know I will lose with great certainty if nothing is done!

[GREEN2172]

Have any non-legacy DH been able to compete with legacy DH without a discipline problem?

Captain. He had ~79 dyscypline, and he managed very well his cd of preparation. I losed vs him with 4b legacy set, but to be honest he is just better player, better aiming, tactics etc.

[Iria]

I retract my legacy Natalya problem since I went roughly even with Myst in the VC tournament (was 3:2 Myst). I now have a problem with 4 piece Blackthorne DH (with 50B+ gear) lol. Also, I am having issues with overly tanky WDs either the kind that have 200k+ hp (like Chucknorris) or 100k+ hp with elite damage taken -25%+ and some ranged damage reduction (like Ender and Asmodai). It really bugs me that defensive play is the meta-game now.

[Euronymous]

I retract my legacy Natalya problem since I went roughly even with Myst in the VC tournament (was 3:2 Myst). I now have a problem with 4 piece Blackthorne DH (with 50B+ gear) lol. Also, I am having issues with overly tanky WDs either the kind that have 200k+ hp (like Chucknorris) or 100k+ hp with elite damage taken -25%+ and some ranged damage reduction (like Ender and Asmodai). It really bugs me that defensive play is the meta-game now.

The WD that won that tournament posted some vids:
Ender vs. Zee and Mystical
http://www.twitch.tv/gardettos/b/399858417
http://www.twitch.tv/gardettos/b/399875756

The guy has max. 1b gear and isn't even using his Horrify most of the time and beats two of the top server DHs
Just shows you how OP WD is vs. DH.

[Iria]

Yeah and WD more OP now with better Fire Bats and Blood Ritual. I think the game is just uneven now lol.

[KNHO]

The biggest problem is the automatic hitting skill haunt...
This wd just runs around like a gay, and casts in all directions haunt...no need brain, no need aim, no need any skill, just press 1 button and be glad.

[chucknorris#1885]

totaly agree wd is gotten big buff. and haunt needs its hit box made small for more aimed shots.

However I got a chance to test against the dh strat I mentioned and it is still very effective vs new wd. imo the current builds you use against me and most dh use vs wd are a big mistake and you can significantly improve your chances by using better build. so suggest u experiment. after the big prize pool tourney I will make a post about pvp effective pvp strats for classes that need some help figuring it out. imo dh has potential to = wd and monk has potential to > wd.

[Euronymous]

Stop being so selfish and just post it already. You are holding back information that supposedly helps classes for months now because of some tourney with a potential prize of what, $50? Bullshit.

[KNHO]

I think thats a big Bullshit, right Euronymous.
This would mean that all the Dh´s out there are stupid, and couldn´t figure out in thousands of duels how to deal with WD´s.

[Iria]

Please don't tell me the strategy is something silly like going full tank DH and kiting between Aid Station Sentries with Brooding, that is just silly. Also, I know of several interesting tactics but they don't work very effectively:

Spike Trap - Sticky Trap the dogs -> Fan of Knives. Doesn't work when the dogs have so much EHP they survive critical Fan of Knives and the WD can just dismiss the dogs and resummon them. Also, the AoE range is rather limited with a running WD.

Spike Trap - Echoing Blast with Caltrops - Torturous Ground. Requires legacy Natalya's with MASSIVE discipline, the idea is to vault into the WD, spam Smokescreen, Caltrops, and Spike Traps to keep the WD snared. Doesn't work if the WD is so tanky the DH runs out of discipline before that occurs. Furthermore, it leaves the DH open with no discipline, also the 0.5 second windows between Smokescreens can get the DH into serious trouble with Fire Bats and Spirit Barrage.

[predsr]

a rapid fire with a stun seems to be effective sometimes, not tested for a long time tho